Drowning on the Arkansas

[Paddlegal]

http://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2010 ... -20100605/

Oh. Were these men...did we know them? Oh how very very sad. Prayers given up for their loved ones sorrow. Apparently in inflatable kayaks with no life jackets on.

[Cowper]

Somewhat of a mystery at this point. One TV story showed a brief photo of the kayaks; both appeared to be in good shape and fully inflated. Hard to fall off and no reason to drown, unless significant currents were involved.

River gages are a bit inconclusive, but as best I can figure the river looks to have been near 70,000 cfs. Their launch and recovery points appear to be well downstream of Murray Lock and Dam, and no mention of the lock in any report. So I don't think hydraulics at the dam were a factor. I think "small craft advisories" are posted at about 70,000 cfs, so the river was near that level, but even so I would expect them to flip on an eddyline in an inflatable.

If they swamped or fell out due to a passing barge, I'd think they'd just climb back in. The only thing that makes sense to me is that there must be a small hydraulic forming over one of the jetties; it may only be there at a very specific level. This is PURE SPECULATION but it is the only thing that makes sense to me; whatever it was got two people, neither was able to either save himself or assist his loved one. You know a father/son would have tried if it was possible.

I'm not so sure about the life jacket thing - I think one was recovered; it was one of the "horsecollar" type, so even if worn it might have come off if they got into something more serious than expected (think low head dam type hydraulic - that's what it looks like when the level is just right and the water goes over a barely-submerged jetty).

To the family members; my heart goes out. Please forgive us for trying to speculate about seemingly unimportant details of what happened, but if we can figure out those details, it might lead to an appropriate warning sign or informational poster at this popular launch site that could spare someone else from having to experience the pain you now feel.

[okieboater]

I do not have any faith that the horsecollar type PFD's work except maybe in a swimming pool.

I wish the manufacture of this type PFD would be stopped. In my opinion, the horse collar PFD's give a false sense of security which often leads to tragic situations.

Prayers go out to the family for this loss.

[Wildwood]

I got to the put in for the AR River Canoe & Kayak Race on Friday afternoon to check out conditions for yesterday mornings race. The bodies had been pulled from the river about 15 minutes earlier. River was running at 68,000 cfs. but looked great, no logs or debris visible. I'm somewhat hesitant to go when water is swirly, but it was fine for me, (a beginner last summer).

I just wonder about those PFD's. Why does anyone buy that type at all?

A prayer was said for the families at the beginning of the race yesterday, and will remain in my prayers. They will probably never have answers to their questions about this tragedy.

[Cowper]

I just wonder about those PFD's. Why does anyone buy that type at all?

Each type of PFD has some advantages and disadvantages. Those are inexpensive, and it is always better to have a PFD than to not have one. They also typically have a lot of floatation, and are good at keeping an unconcious or injured person face-up. But they have to be put on pretty well to not come off; I think the standards for Type III's require the vest to stay on with higher "impact velocity", which is also a good indicator of how well the vest will stay on in turbulent water.

[Wildwood]

The photo of the vest in the newspaper shows only one strap (unfastened) to secure (?) the device to the body. No zipper or snaps. Regardless of it's ability to keep someones head above water, if it won't stay on, it does no good . . .

[painterbob]

you can add two more to the list. i'm sad to say that two childern lost there lives at the ponca bridge on sat. late in the day. they were playing above the bridge on the boxley side .and one went under the bridge and the other went under after them , both died.. ......at this time. this all that i know...

[potterspoint434]

Since I paddle the Ar River about 3 or 4 times a week and paddle that area I feel I know a lot about it. I would agree the eddyline was what I thought. I was down there most of the afternoon and was there when the men were found . I looked at the area and it was strange to me that 2 men could not swim to shore from where they seem to be. Like every one has said we will never know.
I feel the Arkansas River is the most under used river in the state. The TV stations were saying Memorial Day to stay off the river it was 5 times the normal flow which was a lie, I was looking at it on my computer the flow was 80,000 . Channel 4 even said people should never be on the river and that it is against the law to water ski on it and that is another lie.
About 4 or 5 weeks ago the river had zero current I could paddle faster up stream faster then down just because of the wind. Sometimes the River is dangerous and we need to stay off of it but most of the time the river is a great place to paddle.
I am the race directer for the kayak race that was held the next day and I think that is why the local paddlers don`t support the race they are afraid of the river. We have more out of state paddlers come in for the race than in state. I put on the race to promote paddling and and it just doesn`t seem to be much interest in central Arkansas for flat water paddling.
I feel for the men`s family that drowned and we will never know what happen . I think we need to educate the people about paddling on the Arkansas River so people in central Arkansas can see its beauty.

[martinm]

I agree that the Arkansas River is a great resource. It just has some squirrly currents when the flow is above 70,000 cfs or so. The eddy lines coming off the ends of the jettys can be tricky at these flows and higher.

I live about two miles from Murray Park and paddle the river with kayak or canoe about 3 or 4 times per week, just to practice my strokes. You can just about always see something interesting. For example, scissor tail fly catchers, Eastern Kingbirds, snakes, turtles and such are almost always present. Also, when the river is at a low flow, the sand bar and sand beach on the N. Little Rock side are a good place to practice rolls, as long as you have a partner.

That said, when the river is up, it has swirling currents, eddy lines and such than can be pretty deceptive from a distance. Once you get on the moving water, it isn't as calm at it looked. One needs to be mindful and always wear a good III pfd.

Even this morning, it looked pretty calm, but was moving along at about 2 or 3 feet per second. If you fall out, it will be a pretty good ride before you can swim to a shore, even with a pfd.

MM

[Cowper]

DeBo and I put in at Burns Park today, motored up to within a few hundred yards of the Big Dam Bridge, and down as far as Cajun's Wharf. There were a few eddylines, the strongest being behind the mid-river buoys, but nothing that we could imagine flipping an inflatable. Currents at the dam were pretty deadly looking, but far upstream from the reported accident scene, and there's no way it could have happened there without 20 folks calling 911. I've heard of lake drownings where someone jumps in to swim and the wind simply blows their boat away faster than they can swim after it. Maybe???

On the Buffalo incident, I see the gage was reading 25 CFS at Ponca yesterday. There should have been a couple of feet or more airspace at the bridge, and only a gentle current flowing under it. Doesn't make sense.

[waterhog]

veryvery sad my heart gos out to the family and friends there seems to be an increase in accidents on the arkansas. We have to remember that it is not just the [pfd] that will save our lives it will simply do its job keep you afloat it will be the combination of this {pfd} and your skill or wit or someoneesles skill or wit that will get you out of the river and to safety the :pfd: will only do what it can(PFDs are very important do not take what i am about to say out of context) the word LIFE JACKET is to me misleading in a sense that oh if i put this on im gonna be fine it will save my life but it is a combonation of your equipment,fellow boaters,rescuers,you, ect.
eddie line on the ark at bigger levels can and will take you down for a while it is the same kind of current that squirt boaters use but if your a good swimmer you shoud be able to swim away from such currents.
Again always wear your pfd at all times what i said above is not ment to steer you away from wearing a pfd always be safe on the river


peace out to the boaters on the other side

[Wildwood]

Waterhog, your post brings to mind something I see so often---people (who think it doesn't look cool to wear a PFD??) taking their PFD along but not wearing it. Sometimes it's stashed behind the seat. Do they just not realize how fast a boat can flip over? :shock: Are they just too macho? Do they think they are so experienced they won't ever need a PFD? :roll: Someone tell me what's up with this, please.
Thanks.
Jan

[Gordon Kumpuris]

Logic is not always correct but if you use logic to look at this you can make I think some pretty safe assumptions........

Known facts...... The kayaks were inflatable and thus probaby fairly light.
Horse collar type PFD's were in their possession at some point during the excursion.
The river was flowing but was far from what most would consider flood stage.
The air temperature was warm, the water temperature was mild and it was daytime.
It is highly likely that both were swimmers. Very hard to beleive that non-swimmers would be in a kayak on a body of water that would typically terrify a non-swimmer.

It is all but inconceivable that a father and son launched in the Arkansas River w/o PFD's at least in their possession. Since they were in inflatable kayaks the most obvious and easiest way to transport them is to actually wear them. I suspect that they launched with them on their bodies and at some point removed them.
I think the bottom line is that this should be classified as a likely swimming drowning vs what is being called a kayak accident. I speculate that they were on a sandbar just swimming and one or both became destressed/tired/paniced. The second may have come to aid the first victim and would up being another victim.. Cowper's suggestion of the boat blowing away and them panicing and swimming after it also seems a good possibility. In this scenario perhaps felt they could swim faster without the horse collar PFD? (perhaps an accurate assumption but a deadly one)
Ironically, we teach our children to rid themselves of their "floaties" so they can learn to swim on their own. This by and large is a very good thing. Yet it I think leads to a mentality especially with men and boys that "only non-swimmers" or "weenies" would swim on purpose/for recreation wearing a PFD right? Jan is right...There is a mind set that the PFD is only for emergencies and that it can be donned at that point. We must instill in people that it is OK, and wise to wear a PFD. Getting rid of the dorky looking, uncomfortable, cheap horse collar PFD's would be a good start. They are in my opinion would be a good option to don if you were on a ship about to sink but are not much good for anything else. Type III would be a much better option.
We could use some athletes (pro swimmers maybe) (tough guy types) to do some public service announcements discussing the importance actually wearing the life jacket.

[Louiscov]

What an unspeakable tragedy at Ponca Saturday. Everybody hug your children & family and tell them you love them today. Very numbing.


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